HO N&W steam (was Re: HO Scale limited runs)

[NW Modeling List]

Yes.  It would be fun.  I find it interesting how many errors and omissions there are in the books that have been published on brass models.  This could be an opportunity to compile a very accurate and complete listing of locomotives (steam, diesel, and electric), cabs, freight cars, passenger cars, and misc. equipment produced in brass from Japan and Korea. Likewise it could also include specific N&W prototypes produced in plastic.

Ed Painter  Narrows, VA - looking out my office window at the snow in Arkansas

From: nw-modeling-list-bounces at nwhs.org [mailto:nw-modeling-list-bounces at nwhs.org] On Behalf Of NW Modeling List
Sent: Thursday, January 20, 2011 11:19 AM
To: NW Modeling List
Subject: Re: HO N&W steam (was Re: HO Scale limited runs)

Uh, Ed: did you realize that you just volunteered to do a clinic or share a clinic podium to the guy who's trying to get presenters in an area where he doesn't know people??  Thanks.
[can you send your e address to bongiovanni1 at hotmail.com<mailto:bongiovanni1 at hotmail.com> please?]

Frank Bongiovanni
Clinic Guy for the 2011 NWHS convention in Norfolk.
On Thu, Jan 20, 2011 at 9:29 AM, NW Modeling List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org<mailto:nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org>> wrote:
Thanks Frank......I somehow forgot the LMB M's.  I have 2 that had been my Dad's collection.  A clinic would be a good idea.  I'd be glad to do one either alone or with another person at Norfolk this summer.  Perhaps it could be extended to include the plastic N&W prototype models too?   There has been a lot of progress and improved quality in that area in recient years.

Regards, Ed Painter - Narrows, VA currently living in snowy Arkansas (at least for today)

________________________________
From: nw-modeling-list-bounces at nwhs.org<mailto:nw-modeling-list-bounces at nwhs.org> [nw-modeling-list-bounces at nwhs.org<mailto:nw-modeling-list-bounces at nwhs.org>] On Behalf Of NW Modeling List [nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org<mailto:nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org>]
Sent: Wednesday, January 19, 2011 8:00 PM
To: NW Modeling List
Subject: Re: HO N&W steam (was Re: HO Scale limited runs)
Thank you Marty and Ed.  And don't forget the LMB N&W 4-8-0.  This can be found, is not too expensive, and runs well (okay; mine does).  I'm not in a position to vouch for the accuracy.  That said....since I miss Bob Riffe too, would anyone like a clinic on N&W and VGN brass at the next convention??

Frank Bongiovanni
On Wed, Jan 19, 2011 at 2:53 PM, NW Modeling List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org<mailto:nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org>> wrote:
Some additional brass models of N&W shifters and M-2's:

*         Precision Scale Models produced a very limited run of ex-C&O, N&W  S-1s.  I have one that is factory painted.  This is a very accurate model a rare find and expensive.

        These can run from $600 to $1000 if you can find one.


*         Tenshodo/PFM produces a Crown model of the C&O C-16 and N&W S-1.  I have 3 of these.  Some notes I found on it are be are listed below:

The Chesapeake & Ohio C-16 0-8-0's were built by Baldwin in 1948, and served well until 1950 when they were sold to the N&W due to the new dieselization program. The N&W made some changes to the (now S-1) 0-8-0's after they bought them from the C&O. Specifically they added a second air pump to the fireman side, with a bump in the running board above it, and two smaller air tanks. In addition the left check valve was moved higher up the boiler and the headlight was replaced with a different type. They also modified the tenders to N&W design.  The HO Tenshodo brass model was basically well constructed and detailed, for its time, but the engine represented the N&W version, while the tender is the unmodified C&O version. The engine also had Lima, not Baldwin builders plates.  The model as sold was not correct for either railway's version.

        These can go from $175 to $350

*         Precision Scale Models produced models N&W M-2's, M-2b's, and M-2c's.  Very fine quality, accurate models.  I have one of each.
        These can run from $600 to $1100
*         Sunset produced a M-2.  I sold mine a while back.  Still a nice model.
                These can go from $350-$600
Ed Painter  - Narrows, VA currently living in Arkansas



From: nw-modeling-list-bounces at nwhs.org<mailto:nw-modeling-list-bounces at nwhs.org> [mailto:nw-modeling-list-bounces at nwhs.org<mailto:nw-modeling-list-bounces at nwhs.org>] On Behalf Of NW Modeling List
Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2011 5:57 PM
To: NW Modeling List
Subject: HO N&W steam (was Re: HO Scale limited runs)

The only non-brass N&W steam models that are correct out of the box are the J (Bachmann, Broadway Limited, MTH), A (Broadway Limited), Y3 (Proto), and Y6b (Precision Craft).  Technically, the Proto Y3 models with the footboard pilots are switchers; N&W mainly used them in Roanoke, Portsmouth, Bluefield, and other heavy switching assignments.
N&W's most famous switchers were the S1's purchased from C&O, and the S1a copies built in Roanoke.  These were basically modernized USRA 0-8-0s, so you could start with either an IHC or Proto 0-8-0, and modify it to suit your needs.  PFM imported some S1a's, which you should be able to find for less than $800.00.
N&W also used older 2-8-0, 4-8-0, and 4-6-0 engines in yard service.  NWSL imported a W2 2-8-0 which can usually be found for well below $500, and Sunset offered the M and M1 4-8-0s.  Bachmann Spectrum's high drivered 4-6-0 makes a decent stand in or kitbash starting point for a V1 4-6-0.

Marty Flick

----- Original Message -----
From: NW Modeling List<mailto:nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org>
To: NW Modeling List<mailto:nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2011 4:40 PM
Subject: Re: HO Scale limited runs

Hi all, this is my first posting hope i am doing this right.

I have a question, speaking of limited runs. What are my real options for steam n&w locomotives? BESIDES the j, y, and a. I would like a switcher, because i have already have the j and just got a class a. I would like something to switch my yard. I have heard brass is the only real option for a good model, but i cannot find any around or i think it is crazy to pay 800 plus dollars for something i need to hack to dcc  and paint myself.....

Any suggestions?

David
On Tue, Jan 18, 2011 at 3:43 PM, NW Modeling List <nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org<mailto:nw-modeling-list at nwhs.org>> wrote:

I think the reality is that the model companies realized that the world changed and that to make a profit, they had to change the way they marketed and sold their products.  It was common for modelers to not buy the initial run of products but wait until the discounters offered a lower price a year or two later.  That action cuts into the manufacturer's margin as it drives the overall market price (not cost) down on specific items and items in general.
For instance, everyone knew that LifeLike would eventually mark down their remaining inventory and sell it through their discounting arm.  They were competing against themselves in essence.  (Dumb.)

One of the reasons that the PRR owned so much stock in other railroads and coal  fields in the 1880-90's and early 1900's was to control the freight rates; railroads were undercutting each other to move coal so much that the profit margin was negligible for the railroad.  By being on the board of a railroad, the PRR men wouldn't allow poor or risky business practices that would be ultimately bad for all railroads.

With the model makers making limited runs, they can take control of the pricing again.  By limiting the production, they can reduce or eliminate the discounting efforts of the distributors or dealers to compete between  themselves.  This keeps the prices up and the resulting margins for the manufacturer.  For most distributors, this is a good thing.  For a 'basement bomber' whose business depends on having a lower price than anyone else, he will find it difficult to get inventory or get inventory at a price that makes it possible to him to discount effectively.

This is a normal business cycle.  Mass production requires extensive distribution systems to get the thousands of items to thousands of buyers.  Periodically, the manufacturer has to 'clean up' his distribution system and distribution business model to get his costs and pricing back into a desirable ratio.

The market has changed, too.  Most of the buyers today do not want to build anything, paint anything or decal anything.  You can observe this at any model/toy train show.  The scratch building parts don't sell, decals don't sell in any volume and complex kits go unsold.

Gary Rolih
Cincinnati

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