[game_preservation] Release date of the Odyssey?
Devin Monnens
dmonnens at gmail.com
Tue Aug 7 18:09:48 EDT 2012
I got another idea: when did Ralph Baer get his first check? He'd have to
remember the approximate date, since he was hospitalized at the time...
On Tue, Aug 7, 2012 at 6:04 PM, Devin Monnens <dmonnens at gmail.com> wrote:
> An article publication date is not necessarily the same thing as a
> purchase date. So it is possible that even though these articles say 'this
> is the system, this is how it works, and this is how much it costs', you
> might not be able to go out and buy them. However, I admit that sounds kind
> of silly... Why put out an article for something that isn't available now?
>
> But I agree that these articles are not definitive proof of an August
> release, even if they suggest it.
>
>
> On Tue, Aug 7, 2012 at 6:00 PM, Frank Cifaldi <fcifaldi at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> So do we think that an August article date means that the system came out
>> in August? Because my assumption would be that there was a standard
>> three-month lead time before print, and these articles are based on seeing
>> the Odyssey during the Carvan Tour in May/June.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Aug 7, 2012 at 2:54 PM, Devin Monnens <dmonnens at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Thank you for clarifying the release dates, Benj and Frank. I think this
>>> holds true for the US, but probably not so much for Japan where they had
>>> mastered the system of 'on-demand shipping' as part of the economy. Surely
>>> this was the case during the Famicom era, at least, hence why there are
>>> release dates for those games. It does seem pretty silly to think about
>>> 'release dates' when those didn't exist at the time. It's more about 'when
>>> and were did this go on sale first?' or 'when was it first shipped from the
>>> warehouse?' or 'at about what time would these have been available?'
>>>
>>> Yeah, I think the August date comes from the August and September
>>> articles from 1972 here:
>>>
>>> http://www.magnavox-odyssey.com/Advertising.htm
>>>
>>> Either that, or from one of the earlier game history books. Electronic
>>> Design suggests that the system was coming out after August, but the others
>>> suggest it is available at the date of publication. (Sadly, the 1973
>>> Consumer Reports article is missing the very beginning!).
>>>
>>> I think the surefire way to tell would be to locate ads and sales flyers
>>> from the period. If it's available for sale, it's advertised. However, I
>>> doubt those are easy to find... Same would go for shipping orders, but it's
>>> probably easier to just find receipts!
>>>
>>> BTW, here's the Christmas 1972 Sears Catalog:
>>>
>>> http://www.wishbookweb.com/1972_Sears_Christmas/index.htm
>>>
>>> ADDENDUM: Ok, there's actually NO Magnavox Odyssey advertised in this
>>> catalog! Looked under games and TVs. Nothing. Either I missed it (and
>>> again, I looked pretty thoroughly), or it's not advertised. No wonder the
>>> Odyssey didn't sell well - if it's not in the Christmas catalog, how are
>>> people going to know to buy it?? For this reason, I don't think you'll find
>>> ads for the Odyssey, unless it's from a local Sears in the Sunday paper.
>>>
>>> Was anyone aware of this?
>>>
>>> However, check out these pages from the 1975 catalog:
>>>
>>>
>>> http://www.wishbookweb.com/1975_Sears%20C%20Web/images/SearsC1975_Page410.jpg
>>>
>>> http://www.wishbookweb.com/1975_Sears%20C%20Web/pages/SearsC1975_Page537.htm
>>>
>>> Anyone have a clue what those electromechanical Pong games are on 537?
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Aug 7, 2012 at 4:53 PM, Frank Cifaldi <fcifaldi at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>> I still can't find where August came from. The closest I can find is
>>>> the review in the August 17, 1972 issue of Electronic Design (scanned and
>>>> printed in Ralph's book), which simply says "starting this fall." Anyone
>>>> able to back this up, or is this another one of those "internet truths"
>>>> that gets spread without an actual source?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Aug 7, 2012 at 9:49 AM, Benj Edwards <
>>>> editor at vintagecomputing.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Thanks, Frank. It's good to see you too. I have the highest respect
>>>>> for everyone I've seen so far on this list, so I'm glad I've finally joined
>>>>> up.
>>>>>
>>>>> I've asked Ralph a few times about the release date of the Odyssey,
>>>>> and he simply points to his book, "Videogames...In The Beginning." From
>>>>> that book, I determined a general August 1972 release date (I don't have
>>>>> the exact page number on hand).
>>>>>
>>>>> Ralph can't provide a more precise answer because he doesn't (and
>>>>> didn't) have access to internal Magnavox records, and he wasn't privy to
>>>>> internal marketing and distribution conversations at Magnavox.
>>>>> Essentially, he did his initial work (Brown Box prototype) and handed off
>>>>> to Magnavox, who made a commercial product out of it.
>>>>>
>>>>> Coincidentally, I took apart a Magnavox Odyssey a few months ago and
>>>>> turned it into a slideshow for PC World. Anyone interested in the Odyssey
>>>>> (and moss) might enjoy it.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.pcworld.com/article/256101/inside_the_magnavox_odyssey_the_first_video_game_console.html
>>>>>
>>>>> As an aside, you guys might enjoy looking at this US patent for the
>>>>> Odyssey's exterior plastic housing:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.google.com/patents?id=kK4nAAAAEBAJ&zoom=4&dq=magnavox%20game&pg=PA1#v=onepage&q=magnavox%20game&f=false
>>>>>
>>>>> It has the designers' names on it, if anyone feels like tracking them
>>>>> down. I did a little work on that front, but had to abandon it to move on
>>>>> to another project.
>>>>>
>>>>> Kind Regards,
>>>>> Benj
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 8/7/2012 12:16 PM, Frank Cifaldi wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi Benj! Great to see you here. I agree 100% too, there was no firm
>>>>> release date for the Odyssey. In fact, I'd be curious to know where August
>>>>> even came from, do you have a source for that Devin?
>>>>>
>>>>> My go-to source for this would be Ralph Baer himself, who took
>>>>> meticulous notes. I have in front of me a production copy of his book and a
>>>>> pre-release manuscript (JUST IN CASE!). According to Baer, Magnavox started
>>>>> showing the Odyssey on the traveling Magnavox Profit Caravan show on May 3,
>>>>> 1972, and "over the following months Magnavox began supplying the dealers
>>>>> with production units."
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Aug 7, 2012 at 8:40 AM, Benj Edwards <
>>>>> editor at vintagecomputing.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Devin,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm new to the list -- hope you don't mind if I jump in.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> From my experience, the concept of a firm "release date" for a
>>>>>> product was much different in 1972 than it is today. As far as I know,
>>>>>> companies didn't set a single date for a worldwide or even nationwide
>>>>>> release back then -- the supply chain to pull something off just wasn't
>>>>>> that efficient at the time. The marketing and communication methods of the
>>>>>> day weren't as instantaneous as today either, so a simultaneous nationwide
>>>>>> release, even if they could pull it off, wouldn't have meant as much for
>>>>>> the product PR wise.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What you'd probably find if you dug into the release dates for the
>>>>>> Odyssey is that Magnavox started shipping units to retail distributors on a
>>>>>> certain date (this might be the most definitive single date you could
>>>>>> find), but the actual Odyssey units probably trickled into stores
>>>>>> throughout the month of August 1972 and even further throughout the rest of
>>>>>> the year. So you'd have Odyssey units first available at different
>>>>>> retailers at different times. (And by the way, it's possible -- I don't
>>>>>> recall -- that the Odyssey 1 was only sold through authorized Magnavox
>>>>>> retailers.)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Whenever I search for a single release date for a tech product
>>>>>> released, say, before 1990, I almost never find one. It's obvious through
>>>>>> contemporary press reports that the companies did not announce such precise
>>>>>> dates to the media. Even if they did, the press didn't find it important
>>>>>> enough to report the specifics of availability beyond a season like "Fall
>>>>>> 1981" or a certain month (although even the specific month is rare, and it
>>>>>> gets more uncommon the further back in the past you look) -- probably for
>>>>>> the reasons I described above. As far as I know, the precision to get
>>>>>> product into every store nationwide by a certain date just hadn't been
>>>>>> achieved in the electronics industry yet. Either that or nobody cared
>>>>>> enough to try to pull it off until much later.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Kind Regards,
>>>>>> Benj
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 8/7/2012 11:17 AM, Devin Monnens wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Do we have a more accurate release date for the Odyssey than
>>>>>> 'August 1972'? I know there was a big hullaballoo about how nobody knows
>>>>>> the release date of Super Mario Bros., but one would think there would be
>>>>>> better documentation from Magnavox (such as Sears ads).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -Devin
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Devin Monnens
>>>>>> www.deserthat.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The sleep of Reason produces monsters.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Freelance Writer / Editor in Chief VC&Ghttp://www.benjedwards.comhttp://www.vintagecomputing.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Freelance Writer / Editor in Chief VC&Ghttp://www.benjedwards.comhttp://www.vintagecomputing.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>
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>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Devin Monnens
>>> www.deserthat.com
>>>
>>> The sleep of Reason produces monsters.
>>>
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>>>
>>
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>
>
> --
> Devin Monnens
> www.deserthat.com
>
> The sleep of Reason produces monsters.
>
--
Devin Monnens
www.deserthat.com
The sleep of Reason produces monsters.
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