<div dir="auto"><div>The operating book rules calls out the AAR rules in my '51 and '45 rule book. That is speed signaling, although if you look at the rules as written they do a bad job explaining that. The only thing that usually drove medium speed was a diverging route in a turnout.</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Is there another facing point turnout ahead?</div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">David Baker</div><div dir="auto"><br><div class="gmail_quote gmail_quote_container" dir="auto"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Jun 18, 2025, 6:44 PM NW Mailing List <<a href="mailto:nw-mailing-list@nwhs.org">nw-mailing-list@nwhs.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">Grant,<div>Thanks for the reply and great seeing you at the con as well. Your answer caused me to dig more deeply into the history of N&W aspects/indications and in particular the horizontal arm over vertical arm aspect that has most recently been referred to as "diverging clear". Please refer to the attached pages from N&W rule books as reference for what follows.</div><div><br></div><div>In 1910 it was called "slower speed route clear" when used in conjunction with one high speed route and diverging routes. Seems clear this was speed signaling.</div><div><br></div><div>In 1915 it was "proceed under control, being prepared to stop".</div><div><br></div><div>In 1930 it was just "proceed". Does anyone have a copy of the rules between 1915 and 1930? I'd like to know what that one has to say.</div><div><br></div><div>In 1945 it was " proceed through diverging route at prescribed speed". This looks like route signaling. Again if someone has intervening information, I'd appreciate knowing about it.</div><div><br></div><div>In 1951 it was " proceed through turnout route at prescribed speed" which would seem to indicate route signaling, but the aspect name is "medium clear" which point toward speed signaling.</div><div><br></div><div>In 1961 it was the same but showed the option of a colorized aspect.</div><div><br></div><div>As far as I know this was maintained until the end of the N&W. The term through diverging or turnout route seems to reinforce my questioning its use where one line "joins" another. When I visited Tom Dressler many years ago, he informed me that going "through" a turnout was to take the diverging path while going "over" a turnout meant staying on the non-diverging route. Both of these would indicate a facing points movement and wouldn't seem to be readily applicable to trailing points movements.</div><div><br></div><div>The NORAC definition of this aspect is something like proceed at medium speed until you train clears turnouts or interlockings and then proceed at prescribed speed. This would seem appropriate for such a situation as we find at Vera, but I have not seen this kink of definition in any reference for N&W signaling.</div><div><br></div><div>Hope there may be more to the story and would welcome input from anyone who has experience/knowledge of how N&W signaling worked and the philosophy used by the system designers.</div><div>Thanks,</div><div>Jim Cochran </div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Tue, Jun 17, 2025 at 7:47 PM NW Mailing List <<a href="mailto:nw-mailing-list@nwhs.org" target="_blank" rel="noreferrer">nw-mailing-list@nwhs.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><u></u>
<div>
<div>Jim,<br>
<br>
Generally. . .<br>
<br>
Route signaling is speed signaling by implication. <br>
<br>
So, diverging aspects can indicate a lower speed through the
diverging route of a turnout, compared to the adjacent track
speed, and regardless of direction.<br>
<br>
So, diverging aspects will be used when facing points, and may be
used when trailing points.<br>
<br>
. . . mostly.<br>
<br>
Good to see you and All at the Convention.<br>
<br>
Grant Carpenter<br>
<br>
On 6/8/2025 10:31 AM, NW Mailing List wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">Attached is a photo of Vera Jct. showing the signal
facing Peavine traffic. Why would the "main stem" from Columbus
have been considered a "diverging" route in this case? Perhaps
it is in some way analogous to middle sidings being signaled for
diverging aspects where they rejoin the main. I tend to think
of diverging aspects being displayed to facing points movements
where they are signaled to take a route that "diverges" from the
one they are currently on. Of course there are no "joining"
aspects, so did the term "diverging" cover the act of taking a
route that your current route is joining? Any thoughts will be
appreciated.
<div>Jim Cochran</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
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