[N&W] Re: Lambert's Point - car capacity question

[nw-mailing-list at nwhs.org]

Oakie:
   Where in Detroit was the coal you loaded going?  K. Borg
_________________________________________________________
Okie,

You make a very good point.  It depends on the density of coal, which varies
from mine to mine.  The coal that you refer to must have been some of the
low-density coal.  I remember a number of years ago when an investigation by
the N & W Car Department revealed that these same cars that you refered to
were being greatly overloaded by the high-density coal from a particular
mine.  So, with a fixed cubic capacity,
some cars will doubtless have less than 100 tons whereas others will have
more than that.  Cars now can accomodate heavier loads of the high-density
coal  since the AAR's permissible gross rail load was raised from 263,000
lb. to 286,000 lb. a number of years ago.

Gordon Hamilton

----- Original Message -----
From: "N&W Mailing List" <mailing-list at nwhs.org>
To: "N&W Mailing List" <mailing-list at nwhs.org>
Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 2004 11:10 PM
Subject: Re: Lambert's Point - car capacity question


 > Having little experience with loading coal hoppers I did load several test
 > coal shipments on the DT&I during the 70's coal boom and was surprised
that
 > a 100 ton car was handling only 83 tons average of mine run E KY coal. We
 > filled them to the brim and they were N&W cars. Shipments were for Detroit
 > and we loaded at Pedro, OH using an old clay truck ramp for direct drop
into
 > the cars.
 >
 > Oakie Ford
 >
 > ----- Original Message -----
 > From: "N&W Mailing List" <mailing-list at nwhs.org>
 > To: "N&W Mailing List" <mailing-list at nwhs.org>
 > Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2004 10:33 PM
 > Subject: Re: Lambert's Point
 >
 >
 >  > Wayne,
 >  >
 >  > Pardon my delay in responding, but I was waiting for some current
 >  > information on export coal train sizes and capacity of ships loaded at
L.
 >  > Pt.
 >  >
 >  > For facts and figures, you can search for "Lamberts Point Coal" on the
Web
 >  > and come up with lots of data.  Three that are particularly informative
 > are:
 >  >
 >  > www.energy.vt.edu/pdfs/VACoal1999.pdf
 >  >
 >  > www.globalsecurity.org/military/facility/lamberts-point.htm)
 >  >
 >  > www.nscorp.com/nscorphtml/coal/transload/lamberts_point.html-3k
 >  >
 >  > I would look askance at the claim that it takes 15 train loads of coal
to
 >  > fill the AVERAGE collier.  A NS source checked AEI scans of export coal
 >  > trains and determined that they are running 170 to 180 100-ton cars per
 >  > train.  The same source determined that the capacity of ships loaded
there
 >  > recently and the number of cars required is as follows:
 >  >      17,000 tons        120 cars
 >  >      27,000                270
 >  >      77,000                750
 >  >      83,500                910
 >  > Although the number of cars for the first listing is obviously too low
to
 >  > fill the ship, the others figure to be about 100 tons/car, which is
what
 >  > would be expected.  The Virginia Tech Web site given above states,
 > "...over
 >  > 150,000 tons of coal have been loaded in a single collier" as though
this
 >  > was something of a record.   Even if this were the average, and we can
see
 >  > it is far from it, one of these largest ships would only require about
 > 1,500
 >  > cars, or some 8.5 train loads.
 >  >
 >  > Gordon Hamilton
 >  >
 >  > ----- Original Message -----
 >  > From: "N&W Mailing List" <mailing-list at nwhs.org>
 >  > To: "N&W Mailing List" <mailing-list at nwhs.org>
 >  > Sent: Sunday, April 11, 2004 11:03 PM
 >  > Subject: Lambert's Point
 >  >
 >  >
 >  >  > All,
 >  >  >
 >  >  > Last year I appealed to the Society for help preparing an article
for
 > the
 >  >  > Roanoke Locomotive Shop newsletter, "The Quality Connection."
Several
 >  >  > members responded and have my gratitude. I tried to send copies of
the
 >  >  > magazine to those who helped out and I hope you all received them.
 >  >  >
 >  >  > Anyway, I'm needing help again; this time with information
concerning
 > the
 >  >  > coal operations at Lambert's Point. I was given a thorough tour of
the
 >  >  > facility on Mar. 3, just after the safety awards ceremonies, but was
 > more
 >  >  > intent on taking pictures than jotting down facts and figures. I
went
 > to
 >  >  > the Salem library to day to browse their back issues of "The Arrow,"
 > but
 >  >  > they don't have a very large collection and I found nothing helpful.
 > Have
 >  >  > there been articles in past issues concerning the coal pier?
 >  >  >
 >  >  > What I'm needing is basic information concerning coal handling,
 > tonnages,
 >  >  > etc. One thing I do remember the Machinist/guide telling us is that
the
 >  >  > average collier holds 15 train loads of coal. A pretty amazing
figure
 > in
 >  >  > itself.
 >  >  >
 >  >  > BTW, I hope I'm not letting confidential information out but telling
 > you
 >  >  > that the signs are that coal exports will be very much higher this
 > year.
 >  >  > The "Business Outlook" speeches at the awards banquet were very
upbeat
 > and
 >  >  > the rumors flying around are predicting that exports may reach
levels
 >  >  > comparable to those of 1996-1997. If these prove to be true, it will
be
 > a
 >  >  > tremendous help with the financial problems NS has experienced
 > recently.
 >  >  >
 >  >  > Also, I've noticed in some of the posts here people mention posting
 >  >  > pictures. If someone will give me an address where to send them,
I'll
 > post
 >  >  > some of the shots I took at the coal pier. I was allowed to go to
the
 > very
 >  >  > top of the loaders and got some pretty nice pictures. I also have
some
 > of
 >  >  > 1218 when (he, she, it?) was in the shop in June of last year; just
 > before
 >  >  > being given to the Transportation Museum. I'll be glad to post some
of
 >  >  > those as well.
 >  >  >
 >  >  > Thank you
 >  >  > Wayne McKinney
 >  >  > Roanoke Locomotive shop
 >  >  >
 >  >  >
 >  >
 >  >
 >  >
 >
 >